Bloom says that Lucifer was an idea invented around 200AD. Is this true? Does that, then, make the serpent in the Garden just that, a serpent?
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Biblical question
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ZachSylvanus |
Biblical question |
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Posts: 384 11/09/02 19:31:28 Amusingly Clever |
I just started reading the book last night, and only read the first two pages (You're all ahead of me, I know :P)
Bloom says that Lucifer was an idea invented around 200AD. Is this true? Does that, then, make the serpent in the Garden just that, a serpent? |
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Chris OConnor |
Re: Biblical question | #1 | ||
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Indisputable BookTalk Master
Posts: 9511 11/09/02 22:39:58 BookTalk Owner |
Zach:
Good question. I'm sure Cheryl will be interested in helping with that one. She knows the Bible very well. And you being behind in the book doesn't worry me. You were ahead of us in Jared Diamond's book the whole time, so we are all trying to pay you back. Chris |
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Johnny Neuron |
My thoughts on Lucifer | #2 | ||
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Intern
Posts: 64 11/11/02 18:05:29 |
Before Cheryl gets a chance to answer let me throw my two cents in. I'm working off of memory and am very lazy at the moment, so some details about my
response might be wrong.
Actually, the name Lucifer is not mentioned as a charachter in the Bible at all. People attributed the name Lucifer to the charachter of Satan in post-Biblical times. Of course, the charachter of Satan underwent a progressive evolution in the Bible itself. He is not mentioned at all in the Penteteuch and receives only scant mention in all of the Old Testament except the book of Job where he is not really thought of as the Devil but as a roving, mischeivous angel "spy" in the court of Yahweh. Only in the New Testament (and intertestimal literature) did the grand personification of Satan as the Devil, Evil one and Temptor become solidified. But the name Lucifer is never applied to him in canonical scripture.
Last Edited By: Johnny Neuron 01/09/08 10:26:22.
Edited 1 time.
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ZachSylvanus |
Re: My thoughts on Lucifer | #3 | ||
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Posts: 384 11/11/02 23:23:59 Amusingly Clever |
Jesus never mentions Satan either....which leads me to believe its another corruption of Christianity. Jesus mentions Gehenna, but not Hell.
Silly Christians, using their religious views to reflect political desires and agendas..... |
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Unregistered(d) |
Re: My thoughts on Lucifer | #4 | ||
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Posts: 0 11/13/02 01:25:59 |
Good observation Bradley, to that I'll add that while never an actual character, the term "Lucifer" was used to describe the king of Babylon in Isaiah 14:12-14. I think that places it somewhere near 700 BC.
Babylon is the nation which conquered the (southern?) kingdom of Isreal, Judah, and held them in captivity for 70 years, I think. They have consequently symbolized the antithesis of God's people, and the pinnacle of utter rebellion against God. The fact that it is observable in New Testament themes is not that remarkable. However, Satan and the Devil are mentioned regularly throughout both the old and new testament and by Jesus and the prophets alike. The following link is a good reference if any of you are interested in further reading. It presents the argument that Satan/Devil are merely personifications of some activity. Satan is translated accuser, and devil is synonymous with sinful nature. There is no actual malicious spirit hunting our souls, according to this interpretation (which is theistic interestingly enough). www.bbie.org/english/Stud...Satan.html |
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- Member Introductions & Journals
- BookTalk News & Development
- Religion, Philosophy & the Arts
- Politics, Current Events & History
- Science, Nature & Technology
- General Discussion & Miscellaneous Topics
- Book Suggestions, Polls, & Reviews
- Additional Book Discussions
- Godless in America: Conversations With an Atheist - by George A. Ricker
- Interventions - by Noam Chomsky
- Religious Expression and the American Constitution - by Franklyn S. Haiman
- Deep Economy: The Wealth of Communities and the Durable Future - by Bill McKibben
- The God Delusion - by Richard Dawkins
- The Third Chimpanzee: The Evolution and Future of the Human Animal - by Jared Diamond
- The Woman in the Dunes - by Abe Kobo
- Evolution vs. Creationism: An Introduction - by Eugenie Scott
- The Omnivore's Dilemma: A Natural History of Four Meals - by Michael Pollan
- I, Claudius: From the Autobiography of Tiberius Claudius, Born 10 B.C., Murdered and Deified A.D. 54 - by Robert Graves
- Breaking the Spell: Religion as a Natural Phenomenon - by Daniel Dennett
- A Peace to End All Peace: The Fall of the Ottoman Empire and the Creation of the Modern Middle East - by David Fromkin
- The Time Traveler's Wife - by Audrey Niffenegger
- The End of Faith: Religion, Terror, and the Future of Reason - by Sam Harris
- Ender's Game - by Orson Scott Card
- The Curious Incident of the Dog in the Night-Time - by Mark Haddon
- Value & Virtue in a Godless Universe - by Erik J. Wielenberg
- The March: A Novel - by E.L. Doctorow
- The Ethical Brain - by Michael Gazzaniga
- Freethinkers: A History of American Secularism - by Susan Jacoby
- Collapse: How Societies Choose to Fail or Succeed - by Jared Diamond
- The Battle for God - by Karen Armstrong
- The Future of Life - by Edward O. Wilson
- What is Good? The Search for the Best Way to Live - by A.C. Grayling
- Civilization and It's Enemies: The Next Stage of History - by Lee Harris
- Pale Blue Dot: A Vision of the Human Future in Space - by Carl Sagan
- How We Believe: Science, Skepticism, and the Search for God - by Michael Shermer
- Looking For Spinoza: Joy, Sorrow, and the Feeling Brain - by Antonio Damasio
- Lies (And the Lying Liars Who Tell Them): A Fair and Balanced Look at the Right - by Al Franken
- The Red Queen: Sex and the Evolution of Human Nature - by Matt Ridley
- The Blank Slate: The Modern Denial of Human Nature - by Stephen Pinker
- Unweaving the Rainbow: Science, Delusion and the Appetite for Wonder - by Richard Dawkins
- Atheism: A Reader - edited by S. T. Joshi
- Global Brain: The Evolution of Mass Mind from the Big Bang to the 21st Century - by Howard Bloom
- The Lucifer Principle: A Scientific Expedition into the Forces of History - by Howard Bloom
- Guns, Germs and Steel: The Fates of Human Societies - by Jared Diamond
- Demon-Haunted World: Science As a Candle in the Dark - by Carl Sagan
- Bury My Heart at Wounded Knee: An Indian History of the American West - by Dee Alexander Brown
- Future Shock - by Alvin Toffler
